Amateur homesteading
How did you deal with water? Right now I’m thinking I’ll just be bringing their water out 2x a day so it isn’t frozen over. I don’t want to deal with a heating element unless I absolutely have to. We have an outside outlet, but it isn’t near the coop so I’d have to run an extension cord, which I’d rather avoid if possible
silly thought: could you attach a solar battery and a gentle heating element to a water trough? (Like the batteries used for pathside lights)
Or another thought: would some kind of reflecting surface help to quickly thaw any ice if water did freeze overnight?
(Shows how little I know about real icy weather 
)
We carried warm water from the house out to the coop in the morning and evening, and used a shallow black rubber feed pan for the chickens' water. The black rubber warms up in sunlight just enough to keep the water from freezing during the day -- our coop had windows, so we made sure to place the pan by one where it would get sun on it most of the day, or you could put it outside in their run. At night sometimes it did freeze, but it's really easy to knock the ice out of the rubber pan by banging it on the ground or wall, and they don't usually drink while they're roosting anyway.
If you have one of these waterers, you could try this:
https://www.achickandhergarden.com/chickens-water-from-freezing/
I think either of Joanne's ideas might work, just don't know how to put them together.
This is the type of water container we have. I use two, one inside the run, one outside. I'll try that salt water bottle trick, and just bring both containers inside every night. Bringing water out every morning isn't that much of a hassle so long as it stays drinkable for the whole day.
Do you eat all the eggs that they lay? I have a friend with chickens and she ends up giving a lot to neighbors.
Well, we always knew that predators were in the area, and that we were taking a risk every time we let our girls free range, but today we finally got hit. And out of six chickens the damned hawk had to take the ONE that my eldest had claimed as his pet and named.
Of course when we went to lay her down one eye kept flickering partway open. Her legs were stiff out, and half of her next was missing at this point, so it was likely some nervous system reaction, but I still didn’t want to risk burying a living, suffering chicken. My husband is a paramedic so I made him get his stethoscope to make sure she was really gone.
I explained to my son that the hawk that killed Chicky isn’t bad, it is just nature’s way. It needs to eat too. We did chase it off though, as she was a pet and I didn’t want her torn apart. We had a little burial and said some nice words about Chicky. The hawk is STILL circling the yard, probably since it now knows there is some good sized prey here, so the rest of the birds are going to remain locked in the run until we figure something out, most likely a larger fenced in run with aviary netting.
mem, the young girls aren't reliably producing yet, and the older ones were producing about 5-6 eggs each per week. We were averaging 3-4 eggs total a day, though the past two weeks it was starting to drop to 2-3 per week since the days are getting shorter. In the beginning we were driving back and forth between Frenchtown and Maplewood a lot, and eating out WAY too much, so we were giving about a dozen eggs to family every 1-2 weeks since we weren't eating that many. But once we started cooking at home more 3-4 eggs per day was actually a good number for us. An average breakfast for five takes about 6-7 eggs. I know the original girls are at peak production now age-wise, so in a year, possibly two, they'll start winding down production, and the younger ones will start stepping up.
We'll be in Maplewood again today. Since the hawk was hanging around for a few hours yesterday, I don't even feel comfortable letting the other hens out into the pen, so they're staying locked up in their enclosed run. They still have fresh air and contact with the ground, but it's small. Their enclosed run is about 8 1/2' by 4 3/4'. That is roughly 40 square feet, for five birds, or about 8 square feet per bird. I know that is more than commercial production hens get, and even "free range" is usually 2 square feet per bird. But even so I think it's too small for them. It's only temporary though until we figure out how to handle the threat from the murder bird. Their food and water are already in the run, I'll give them extra scratch to help occupy them a bit.
Their current outside pen is also small, though still much larger than their enclosed run. As such, hawks are slightly less likely to strike in there, since they prefer open spaces. But with the hawk now knowing that chicken in on the menu at our house, and the open pen not being covered, I don't want to take the chance. One option seems to be putting up fake predator birds, since hawks and other predators don't want competition and will go elsewhere. But I also don't want the chickens to grow accustomed to the sight of a predator hanging out and risk them ignoring the real thing. Another option, that might work for their current outdoor pen, is mylar and other shiny objects. I don't think this would work in a large open field, but in their outdoor pen, which is already smallish in size, mylar strips and hanging CD's might be enough to have the hawk look elsewhere for dinner.
Long term, I think a large permanent run with aviary netting is probably the only way to go. The girls love bushes and such, so it needs to be large enough to plant a few things in to give them variety. Having the fence put up professionally just isn't in the budget right now, and from experience I can tell you that digging post holes SUCKS, even with equipment.
I have a friend in western Pa who put his chicken run on wheels so it can easily be moved from one area to the next. This way the chickens are able to clear out the insects in one area and then get moved to another area to repeat.
I mentioned to our carpenter upstate my fantasies of having livestock. He told me that there's a lot of heartache down that path, as you just described. He said when you have goats, expect some coyotes to visit. And it's not just predators that threaten the animals. There are injuries and medical problems.
The ‘run on wheels’ is called a chicken tractor, or a coop tractor. 
They’ve been around for years. Here’s a link to a site that has several designs that are, I think, free and seem reasonably easy to to build:
https://www.thehappychickencoop.com/chicken-tractor/
Here, predators would include some lizards and snakes as well as foxes and in some areas dingoes and feral cats, as well as birds of prey.
I’ve known farmers in Howlong who moved their chook tractors over various bits of paddock as needed to help break up extra-hard clumps of matted weeds and soil, and help naturally fertilise the soil.
We had a small chicken tractor for them, but I want them to have a larger space, they love to wander. They're miserable being cooped up right now. Even in their outside pen they want more room. We're looking into how difficult it would be to fence in a larger run and top it with aviary netting.
In regards to heartache, I think that is expected with any pet. I had pet mice as a kid. Two years, three if you’re lucky.
Though I guess one could always get a tortoise and if they took good care of it be fairly certain that they’d never have to say goodbye to their pet
I’m sorry about what happened to Chicky. Once a redtail knows there is easy prey available, it will return. I mowed our yard hopefully for the last time this year today, and found the remains of one of the little bunnies that frequent our yard. It saddens me, but there’s not much one can do. Thank you for sharing your experiences through this blog. In such a troubling and divisive time, your blog is one of my Internet happy places!
I'm not awesome at identifying nature. At first I thought red tail, since that was the only hawk I knew but it was grey, which I remember thinking was odd for a red tail. It might have been a cooper's hawk. Either way, Murder Bird has been hanging around, so yes, it definitely knows that there are still five pieces of it's six piece meal waiting to be eaten.
In New Jersey the three common hawks to worry about are red tails, cooper's hawks, and thin skinned hawks. I'm guessing the thin skinned hawk is super sensitive and will cry if I insult it. All three hawks share the same nickname, chicken hawks.
My son was talking to a classmate. They have chickens. She said one night they had 25 chickens when they went to sleep, when they woke up in the morning they only had 6. Having 25 I'm assuming they were either for egg or meat production, not for personal use, so that had to hurt financially. That was what I was always worried about, night time predators. Though from reading up, while night time predators are a real and credible threat, more loss occurs from hawks over time.
One animal that seems to have made a come back here is the fisher (aka fisher cat). People say they're just mean, and don't just kill enough to fill their tummies, but rather will kill the whole coop if given the chance. They are weasels. Years ago I had pet ferrets, also weasels. And while sweet pets, they did have a vicious streak. Mine mostly murdered oranges, but in such a blood thirsty manner, poor oranges never stood a chance, and it was hell to clean up. But funny to watch and it made them happy, so I let them do it. My mother recalls her grandfather also being constantly worried about the mink farmer down the road from him for the same reason. So weasels are already troublesome to start with, but in terms of attitude I'm told that fishers are weasels with a chip on their shoulder.
My inlaws live in Pittstown - and have kept chickens off and on - believe it or not - they had a problem with skunks - they look for the eggs and will kill. Foxes, skunks , raccoons all have great smell and love feed and eggs. Coyotes are also in that area - they hear them at night howling. Good luck!
I love Pittstown, especially that one building with “So this is Pittstown” painted on the side
Ok, this is weird. I wrote a longer post, and 3/4ths of it disappeared. I’m too tired to write it again. I’ll check here in the morning and maybe it will suddenly show up again
Yes I know it well -across from the Pittstown Inn - a great restaurant.! More NYC type of folks have discovered Hunterdon County - much to my familys dismay - that road had only farms on it - the McMansion phase took over before zoning came in. to save the land. To me - not a whole lot out there to do when you are used to Maplewood - no mall, movies or good shopping but they love it! Oh and you need to do lunch or breakfast at the Sky Cafe!!
One of the things that was accidentally erased the other night was a correction. I had misheard my son. His classmate woke up to 16 chickens, not 6, so the carnage wasn't anywhere near as bad as I initially thought. Still, losing 9 chickens in one night has to hurt. I'm sure the chickens weren't too happy about it either.
I'm still trying to plan out their new pen. I'm on my fifth design in less than a week. This might take awhile.
Yes, I was just told to take my kids to the Sky Cafe, and also to check out the airport as they have helicopters there that the kids can look at. And we're waiting until we have some extra cash and a grandparent willing to baby sit so we can try the Inn at Pittstown. Have your parents been to Pattenburg House, and is it worth the drive?
No mall, no movies, no good shopping, no problem. Actually, Rt 31 in Flemington is pretty close by, and it the equivalent of 22 in terms of shopping, so we can easily find everything we need. I've never been into shopping for recreation. I guess if I were a Williams Sonoma type I might be upset. At this point we've averaging one to two movie theater movies a year, so not having that isn't a huge loss for us. Prior to having kids we probably went to the movies monthly, but that was a long time ago in a galaxy far, far away.
I do miss Target. Oddly enough, socks at WalMart are vastly inferior to the socks at Target. Same brand, Hanes. But WalMart carries the cheap thin version. I didn't even try to buy sheets at WalMart. We still have most of the grandparents in Maplewood and South Orange, so even after we finally sell the house we'll still be back there enough that I'll still buy those items from Target when I need them.
There was more to do in Maplewood, but from 2004 to now our taxes had nearly tripled, so we couldn't afford to do anything anyway. We used to justify the proximity of stuff as reason for staying in such a small house for years. Sure, our house was less than 800 square feet (my old apartment was bigger!) but there was so much to do, and we could easily hop on a train to the city, etc. But more and more we just stayed home since all these things cost money, which we no longer had. I think we saw one play at the Papermill Playhouse in the last 20 years. We're still on a shoestring budget, but at least now we have space and hobbies that we couldn't have before. Sure, pet chickens are probably the most expensive way to get eggs (I've heard some people on the chicken forums refer to them as million dollar eggs ) but they're fun. I'm trying to start bayberry seeds in the fridge (cold stratification, it isn't working out too well just yet) so I can plant some of those. But even if the bayberry seeds fail, I only spent a couple of bucks on the seeds so I won't be out too much. And I'm still planning out what I want to try planting in the spring for our garden.
I hear you on the subdivisions and McMansions. All the houses in our immediate area are post 1960's. On the other hand, if they hadn't subdivided, we never would have been able to afford this house if it still had the 100+ acres attached. Down the road a bit there are some McMansions. I have nothing against people who want fancy houses, I'm just wary, since in Maplewood it seemed that every time a house was sold, then flipped, our taxes went up as our once blue collar neighborhood suddenly became hip. I didn't have an ounce of granite in my house, but since multiple houses on our block were flipped, the value of my house supposedly went up along with them. If I can get even half of what the town seems to think my house is worth, I'll be happy.
On a lot of homesteading sites you'll see recommendations on how to be frugal with the grocery budget. Oddly enough, my three favorite things in this category are things I started doing long before we left Maplewood.
1) We bought a vacuum sealer. Buying foods in bulk, or saving leftovers, is much easier if you can freeze them without worrying about freezer burn. I used to wrap meats in butcher's paper and then bag them, which did work, but vacuum sealing meats works better and is less work. One thing I don't vacuum seal is spaghetti. It doesn't come out bad, but for some reason freezing and then thawing cooked spaghetti ends up with it having the exact taste and consistency of Chef Boyardee.
2) Buying a dedicated freezer. We're a family of five, so for us it was almost a must, but even my grandmother had a freezer in her garage when she lived alone. Buying in bulk, making broth from bones, even saving leftovers so you can save money on food but not have to eat the same meal three days in the same week are easier with a freezer. About freezers, locker freezers keep food longer, and freezers WITHOUT a self defrost cycle also keep food longer. That said, I know my limitations, I had a locker freezer and never dug down to the bottom, and I am also not reliable enough to remember to manually defrost the freezer. So for us I made the decision to go with an upright self defrosting freezer. It's still useful, and for us it works. If you're the type to rotate foods and also perform the defrosting on a regular basis, then you'll want to go with the better type.
3) A pressure cooker. I know, everyone has a story about one exploding. Just ask my mother. Don't buy an old school stove top one, buy an electronic one, they're extremely safe. We purchased a multi cooker since it can do more than just pressure cooking. The saute function alone makes it worth it, I can brown stuff and then use the pressure cooker without having to wash two pans. We bought the Fagor Lux at Kitchen A La Mode* in South Orange, and couldn't be happier. They come in different sizes, we went with the 8 quart, and have never run out of room. Beef stew from scratch, where the beef is fall apart tender in less than about an hour (prep time, getting up to pressure time, and 35 minutes of actual cook time)... I only wish I'd bought one sooner. I also have a habit of cooking dry chicken if I do it on the stove top, but using the pressure cooker that no longer happens. A word of warning though, if you make stews and never pay attention to the type of potato you use, you will need to start paying attention. Russets, and other starchy types, will basically disintegrate, especially with longer cook times, like the 35 minutes needed for beef stew. They still taste fine, but the texture of overcooked potatoes kinda defeats the purpose of having delicious home made stew. Use red potatoes, or other waxy types. If I find baby red potatoes I don't even cut them if they're small enough. Buying a pressure cooker item has made a huge difference. I used to use my slow cooker a lot, but you still have to plan ahead, set up ingredients the morning of, or maybe the night before. I still have my crock pot, but my pressure cooker is great for days where I didn't plan ahead, the day got away from us, and I can still make something quickly and have it taste great. I probably use that a few times a week on average.
*I am not affiliated in any way with KALM, I just really like how Ben researched the heck out of this product before deciding which one to carry in his store, and the employees were very helpful in helping me choose which size would best suit my needs.
They have actually been to the Pattenburg House - but that is in Warren County I think - fun place good food but they are really mostly happy at home on their property - they grow veggies now - and love looking at the open sky and quiet. drinks on their porch - - No shopping/ movies for them either.... Interesting note - Joe Piscopo was at the Pattenburg house the night they were there - he was friendly - and apparently lives in Hunterdon County! he did a bit about a nudist camp by his house turns out it is true!
I feel your pain about living in Essex County - way too expensive...
I did see a lawn sign by the Clinton Shop Rite about some event and how Joe Piscapo would be there, so I guess that makes sense if he's somewhat local. My husband met him once many years ago. He also said he was a very nice guy.
I love hearing things like that. Too many times you'll see stories of "I met So-And-So and they were a jerk." So when you hear of meeting someone famous who was really pleasant it's always nice. Many, many years ago when I was working at a small shop in Maplewood Village I met Steve Guttenberg, I believe his father was living in Maplewood at the time. He couldn't have been a nicer guy. His dad was a real sweetheart
There was also a time my husband and I went to a KISS concert (one of their 27 farewell tours, I believe) where my husband (then boyfriend) accidentally walked right into Sebastian Bach. To be fair, neither one of them was looking where they were going. But he was really cool about it.
How do your parents keep the deer out of the veggies? Deer fence? I tried the fishing line and t-post trick, but my kids broke the lines. Not the deer, my kids. I've tried sneaking up on them with Nerf guns, I figure if I can spoke them enough they'll find another yard to poop in, but Nerf bullets don't go that far, and the deer just stare at me like I'm stupid. Can't blame them though. I'm wondering if I'm allowed to shoot at them with a paint ball gun, or would that be violating some law or another?
Oh, they actually had to put in an electrified fence - some sort of simple wire on top of the wirefence-thingy - I could ask more. They actually accept the deer - they have 3 acres and if it is a bad winter -they put down feed/salt in the back of the property. Rabbits and mice seem to be a problem so everyone seems to keep both dogs and cats ( and a shotgun!). They have a barn and used to keep barn cats but they are on Quakertown Rd and lost too many of them to continue. They love the area - and say the "vibe" changes once you cross the 78/287 border into HC from the rest of the state!! LOL! I believe that is so true! Have you joined the Ladies of Hunterdon County on Facebook? lots of good advice on there!
I heard a story on a podcast about a guy whose peach tree was raided by a bear. He set up a sound system that played podcasts, since bears are afraid of human voices. Maybe you can trigger such a thing with a motion detector.
Off topic, but if you find yourself going down 31 to Flemington, check out my sister and BIL’s patisserie. Sweet Melissa’s. Named Best Bakery in NJ this past December by the Star-Ledger.
https://www.sweetmelissapatisserie.com/
In a small strip mall on the right side as you head toward Flemington.
Sorry for the hijack but you won’t be disappointed.
We love Sweet Melissa! Very much a French cafe (reminds me of a brooklyn type of small place)
Last Christmas my inlaws served her Buche Noel that was over the top- however since the Star Ledger award came out said it was hard to get in there
and on another note- the late Cryans in So Orange is now up in Hunterdon right off rt 78 but it is now like a pizza place!!!
So I got one of the hawks wrong. It isn’t a thin skinned hawk. It is a sharp shinned hawk. No idea of how I managed to get that soooo wrong
Well, I wish I could blame autocorrect, but this was a brain fart and is all on me. I’d never heard of the thin shinned hawk before, and when I went to write the post my brain could have sworn it was thin skinned
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Yeah, that is what I’ve heard, that as long as they’re allowed to harden off naturally and grow a good layer of down, they’ll be fine in the winter. It’s if they’re given heat and then suddenly lose it that they have a real issue
There are some breeds that aren’t cold hearty, like this real cool looking Egyptian chicken that I know I’ll never get, that can’t take the cold. But these guys are a mix of Rhode Island Red and White Rocks, so they should be ok.
I do close their coop at night, and I don’t let them out until 7am when I get out of bed. They’re not thrilled with having to wait until 7 to get out, but I want to get into the habit of closing the pop door and waking up every morning now so that come winter I’m already in the habit of it