Gifted and Talented discussions at 1/27/14 and 2/24/14 SOMSD BOE meetings
A child that can multiply and divide fractions is hampered by a curriculum and delivery that requires him or her to spend days on multiplication tables in preparation for an hour of filling in bubbles. It's disingenuous to pretend otherwise.
Physical abuse in schools is rightly condemned. Mental abuse continues unchecked.
Physical abuse in schools is rightly condemned. Mental abuse continues unchecked.
@Jfburch, "education program" is another term for "curriculum" in this context. I'm not sure how you DON'T get that, unless you don't want to.
campbell29 said:
Despite the fact that no other district in NJ has a middle school IB program ( and the one district that had it abandoned it), the IB program went forward, full steam in an extremely quick time frame.
This probably is too nit-picky, but to clarify: An IB program continues to exist, as it has for a dozen or so years, at Rosa International Middle School in the Cherry Hill public school district. It is a magnet school, however, so the distinction may be that SOM's is the only districtwide middle school program in the state.
sprout said:
wnb said:
Assessing students' abilities and needs is a basic function of an educational institution. A school that can't do that effectively is fundamentally dysfunctional. Beyond dysfunction lies willful ignorance.
As I alluded to in a previous page in my example of being assessed for something as 'simple' as a sports team, assessment is a highly imperfect science.
And if we sat around and waited for the perfect science we'd be here forever, so a moot point.
ctrzaska said:
And if we sat around and waited for the perfect science we'd be here forever, so a moot point.
Mar 28, 2014 at 10:30am Edited
That is a simplistic response to a complex problem.
The problem really is not finding the perfect science to answer the question of 'what is gifted'..
The bigger difficulty is defining the answer to "what do we want the outcome to be for our 'gifted' students?" after they are somehow 'identified'.
For example, how would you define assessing and addressing a gifted students' abilities and needs "effectively"?
Is it "effective" if the assessment, and the corresponding addressing of the diagnosed needs:
A) produces a student who can score highly on the NJ ASK (or the upcoming Common Core PARCC assessment)
B) produces a student who can score highly on some other criteria (e.g., the SATs, APs)
C) produces a student who enjoys the process of learning
D) produces a student who can function well in various scenarios (under various conditions)
E) produces a student who can solve various types of problems (e.g., psychological dynamics at home, political, mathematical, etc).
F) produces a student who is likely to find a mate and to have children who are likely to find a mate
G) produces a student who eventually produces something that has value to others
H) produces a student who eventually is financially 'comfortable'
I) results in teaching the student at their academic level (whether they enjoy it or not)
J) provides self- (or another person's) recognition of any student's strengths that are higher than most of their peers
K) produces a student who is a self-directed learner
L) Some or all of the above (possibly in some priority order)
M) Something else
-M1) produces a student who is capable of using 21st century technology
Once you define it, then how would you assess it, and address it? And would you want to address it just for the top 3-5% on some assessment, or for all students?
The problem really is not finding the perfect science to answer the question of 'what is gifted'..
The bigger difficulty is defining the answer to "what do we want the outcome to be for our 'gifted' students?" after they are somehow 'identified'.
For example, how would you define assessing and addressing a gifted students' abilities and needs "effectively"?
Is it "effective" if the assessment, and the corresponding addressing of the diagnosed needs:
A) produces a student who can score highly on the NJ ASK (or the upcoming Common Core PARCC assessment)
B) produces a student who can score highly on some other criteria (e.g., the SATs, APs)
C) produces a student who enjoys the process of learning
D) produces a student who can function well in various scenarios (under various conditions)
E) produces a student who can solve various types of problems (e.g., psychological dynamics at home, political, mathematical, etc).
F) produces a student who is likely to find a mate and to have children who are likely to find a mate
G) produces a student who eventually produces something that has value to others
H) produces a student who eventually is financially 'comfortable'
I) results in teaching the student at their academic level (whether they enjoy it or not)
J) provides self- (or another person's) recognition of any student's strengths that are higher than most of their peers
K) produces a student who is a self-directed learner
L) Some or all of the above (possibly in some priority order)
M) Something else
-M1) produces a student who is capable of using 21st century technology
Once you define it, then how would you assess it, and address it? And would you want to address it just for the top 3-5% on some assessment, or for all students?
C is the most important - but that is just my opinion. All of these outcomes sound wonderful, and of course we would want these kinds of outcomes for all students. It really is only as complicated as we make it. We must first acknowledge (and appreciate) that students are different from one another, and, though we seek equity in outcomes, we won't get it. Structuring our children's education around the purpose of equity of outcomes will fail to serve our individual students. We can strive for learning equity, though, through assessment that is coupled with appropriate curriculum. Delivery, of course is important too, and that is where we hope for more professional development to incorporate better teaching strategies for K-8 teachers. G&T identification (and curriculum and delivery of said curriculum) is just a piece of the puzzle, and unfortunately our district keeps misplacing it. It doesn't need to be mired in all the complexities that the BOE presents, and rather should be taken on in a simple and straightforward way, sticking to core curriculum topics initially, and perhaps branching out in phases over a planned schedule.
Mar 28, 2014 at 11:39am Edited
Hmmm I wonder what The State says about what constitutes an "effective" program.
Come along with me to the link I keep posting. I'll post it again here. Come right along, don't be shy..
http://www.state.nj.us/education/aps/cccs/g_and_t_req.htm
Let's see... Here's a couple of things..
* District boards of education shall take into consideration the PreK-Grade 12 Gifted Program Standards of the National Association for Gifted Children (NAGC) in developing programs for gifted and talented students. The NAGC standards establish requisite and exemplary gifted program standards and can be accessed at NAGC Standard.
* Each curriculum framework developed by the department provides general as well as content-specific information on gifted education (e.g., terminology, examples of appropriate practices). The frameworks can be accessed at http://www.nj.gov/education/frameworks/ or at http://www.nj.gov/education/aps/cccs.
Wow... Links to detailed frameworks, standards, criteria... Hmmm how about that.
But, my head is itchy. I'm going to keep scratching it instead.
Come along with me to the link I keep posting. I'll post it again here. Come right along, don't be shy..
http://www.state.nj.us/education/aps/cccs/g_and_t_req.htm
Let's see... Here's a couple of things..
* District boards of education shall take into consideration the PreK-Grade 12 Gifted Program Standards of the National Association for Gifted Children (NAGC) in developing programs for gifted and talented students. The NAGC standards establish requisite and exemplary gifted program standards and can be accessed at NAGC Standard.
* Each curriculum framework developed by the department provides general as well as content-specific information on gifted education (e.g., terminology, examples of appropriate practices). The frameworks can be accessed at http://www.nj.gov/education/frameworks/ or at http://www.nj.gov/education/aps/cccs.
Wow... Links to detailed frameworks, standards, criteria... Hmmm how about that.
But, my head is itchy. I'm going to keep scratching it instead.
Mar 28, 2014 at 12:45pm Edited
wnb said:
Hmmm I wonder what The State says about what constitutes an "effective" program.
Come along with me to the link I keep posting. I'll post it again here. Come right along, don't be shy..
So, to me it looks like @wnb, you haven't even gone to those links, because the 'frameworks' one is empty, and the cccs is simply the regular NJ core curriculum (not g&t).
And can you find an answer to my question on the NAGC website? What are the desired outcomes?
@Sprout, your question is academically interesting but tangential to the fact that our district is not in compliance with state educational standards.
G&T is integral, not an add on to, the educational standards of this state.
http://www.state.nj.us/education/code/current/title6a/chap8.pdf
See the first section, "Purpose." It's applicable to all students, including gifted & talented students, and including special needs students. The fact is, the "desired outcome" is the same for all students. The path that gets them to that outcome needs to be modified, in some cases, for some students.
The link I'm providing here is within the summary http://www.state.nj.us/education/aps/cccs/g_and_t_req.htm.
wnb said:
See the first section, "Purpose." It's applicable to all students, including gifted & talented students, and including special needs students. The fact is, the "desired outcome" is the same for all students. The path that gets them to that outcome needs to be modified, in some cases, for some students.
I would tend to agree with this. To me, the desired outcome of a G&T program would be an appropriate education for identified kids.
I think that @sprout raises some important issues with regards to the design of a G&T program. While the guiding change document from the BOE was very specific in identified the areas of giftedness that they wanted to address, I think that the district proposal is a not very well thought out collection of strategies that are not completely fleshed out.
Mar 29, 2014 at 3:28am Edited
wnb said:
http://www.state.nj.us/education/code/current/title6a/chap8.pdf
See the first section, "Purpose." It's applicable to all students, including gifted & talented students, and including special needs students. The fact is, the "desired outcome" is the same for all students. The path that gets them to that outcome needs to be modified, in some cases, for some students.
OK, so here's the text of that Purpose -- which as you said, is for all students (and seems to be based on the Common Core):
6A:8-1.1 Purpose
(a) To prepare students for college and career, success in life, and work in an economy
driven by information, knowledge, and innovation requires a public education system
where teaching and learning are aligned with 21st century learning outcomes. The
outcomes move beyond a focus on basic competency in core subjects and foster a deeper
understanding of academic content at much higher levels by promoting critical thinking,
problem solving, and creativity through:
--1. The Core Curriculum Content Standards that specify expectations in nine
academic content areas: the Common Core State Standards in English language
arts and mathematics; and the Core Curriculum Content Standards in the visual
and performing arts; comprehensive health and physical education; science; social
studies; world languages; technology; and 21st century life and careers;
--2. Indicators at benchmark grade levels delineated in the standards that further
clarify expectations for student achievement; and
--3. Twenty-first century themes and skills integrated into all content standards areas.
(b) District boards of education shall ensure that standards, assessments, curriculum,
instruction, and professional development are aligned in a local support system that
enables all students to achieve 21st century outcomes through the establishment of
student-centered learning environments that provide opportunities for academically
diverse students to:
--1. Learn in meaningful, real-world contexts through rigorous and relevant
curriculum that promotes engagement in learning by addressing varying college
and career goals;
--2. Access and use quality learning tools, technologies, and resources;
--3. Become self directed seekers of knowledge able to evaluate, apply, and create
new knowledge in varying contexts; and
--4. Use effective communication, communication technology, and collaboration
skills to interact with cultural sensitivity in the diverse local and world
community.
(c) The Core Curriculum Content Standards, including indicators, enable district boards of
education to establish curriculum and instructional methodologies for the purpose of
providing students with the constitutionally mandated system of “thorough” public school
instruction that promotes college and career readiness.
(d) The Statewide assessment system is designed to measure college and career readiness and
student progress in the attainment of the Core Curriculum Content Standards.
(e) The results of the Statewide assessments shall facilitate program evaluation based on
student performance and shall enable district boards of education, the public, and
government officials to evaluate the educational delivery systems of all public schools.
That purpose seems to focus mostly on College and Career Readiness, and defining what that includes. I don't see mention of the aim that that Kareno is seeking, so I assume a g&t program would not need to include an aim of instilling a love of learning?
It looks like the outcomes of the purpose defined above would translate to something like:
A), B), D), E), K), and M1).
I am surprised not to see a reference to (I): "results in teaching the student at their academic level (whether they enjoy it or not)" -- which I thought would be part of g&t & special needs programs?
Within that 'purpose', perhaps g&t could be satisfied with a combination of Individualization, Differentiation, and Personalization (and I'm borrowing from my comment in @ALee 's thread on Personalized Learning http://forum.maplewoodonline.com/discussion/105752/what-is-personalized-learning ):
The academic core could be taught using a combination of differentiation and individualization. And additional topics (electives, enrichment in a core area, internship/vocational experiences, etc.) approached using personalization (self-directed).
@ALee , I think the core standards will be via 'Individualization', and not 'Personalization', because the 'personalization' (as it reads to me from the chart) seems primarily student-directed, and the student would have the option to cover, or not cover, certain standards. 'Individualization' seems to be closer to the ST Math model of possibilities, as the content path in ST Math appears pre-defined (not student directed), with only the pace as individual.
For reference, I am re-pasting my off-the-cuff list of possible outcomes here:
Is it "effective" if the assessment, and the corresponding addressing of the diagnosed needs:
A) produces a student who can score highly on the NJ ASK (or the upcoming Common Core PARCC assessment)
B) produces a student who can score highly on some other criteria (e.g., the SATs, APs)
C) produces a student who enjoys the process of learning
D) produces a student who can function well in various scenarios (under various conditions)
E) produces a student who can solve various types of problems (e.g., psychological dynamics at home, political, mathematical, etc).
F) produces a student who is likely to find a mate and to have children who are likely to find a mate
G) produces a student who eventually produces something that has value to others
H) produces a student who eventually is financially 'comfortable'
I) results in teaching the student at their academic level (whether they enjoy it or not)
J) provides self- (or another person's) recognition of any student's strengths that are higher than most of their peers
K) produces a student who is a self-directed learner
L) Some or all of the above (possibly in some priority order)
M) Something else
-M1) produces a student who is capable of using 21st century technology
On paper it's all lovely. But it's like a thimbleful of champagne puffed up into a mist.
gaijin said:
On paper it's all lovely. But it's like a thimbleful of champagne puffed up into a mist.
I'm surprised at the thinness of it as well.
This will probably be decided at tomorrow night's BOE meeting.
One scheme has implementation starting at 5th grade, another begins implementation starting in both K and 5th grades and working towards the middle. This is the scheme favored by district principals, but BOE members are skeptical about the ability to determine g&t in K/1st grades, so well see.
One scheme has implementation starting at 5th grade, another begins implementation starting in both K and 5th grades and working towards the middle. This is the scheme favored by district principals, but BOE members are skeptical about the ability to determine g&t in K/1st grades, so well see.
I wonder if the departure of Dr. Furnari will delay implementation even further than it seemed at last discussion.
There's very clear testing protocols to adjudge giftedness. Robert Wood Johnson, among others. It's not merely a case of "my kid is gifted".
Maybe I missed mention of this, but I saw the following draft position posting on the BOE agenda (http://nj.somsd.schoolboard.net/sites/nj.somsd.schoolboard.net/files/C.%203135%20Personnel%20Fiscal%202014.04.28.doc.pdf):
POSITION TITLE Gifted & Talented Specialist
MINIMUM
QUALIFICATIONS
Certified as an Elementary Teacher.
Trained in gifted and talented (“G&T”) strategies.
A working familiarity with the Common Core Standards,
the NJCCCS and the Standards for G&T.
Knowledge of current research and theory in G&T
education.
A minimum of five years teaching experience at the
elementary level.
Demonstrate the necessary skill as a master teacher in
the field of G&T education.
A proven ability to work with and provide leadership for
colleagues.
Staff development experience desired.
REPORTS TO
Assistant Superintendent for Curriculum & Instruction
JOB GOAL(S)
To conduct training of teachers and administrators in
the field of G&T education.
To insure the quality and consistency of a
comprehensive G&T program district wide.
To coordinate instruction for students or groups of
students identified as G&T.
Provide modeling for the new program for classroom
teachers in the differentiation of instruction for G&T
students.
PRIMARY RESPONSIBILITIES
1. Works with students, teachers, parents, and administrators to strengthen student
achievement in G&T education in the areas of: academics, the arts and leadership.
2. Assists with the implementation and review/revision, as appropriate, of the District’s
G&T strategies.
3. Assists teachers in effectively choosing strategies and materials.
4. Uses district established criteria and collects data to help teachers:
Assess student needs
Differentiate instruction
Planning lessons
Evaluate student progress
5. Provides planning and support to teachers in the use of appropriate strategies.
6. Provides mentoring and support for novice teachers regarding differentiation for G&T students.
7. Models lessons and team teaches with teachers using effective strategies for best
reading practices in the classroom.
8. Works collaboratively with supervisors and principals in providing staff development at
building and grade level meetings in the field of G&T education.
9. Works collaboratively with teachers, principals and supervisors to create personalized
learning plans for G&T students.
10. Works with the Assistant Superintendent for C&I to coordinate G&T activities across the
district.
11. Job may require a commitment to provide up to twenty (20) days of summer
employment as determined by the administration.
12. Strives to maintain and improve professional competence.
13. Performs other G&T program support duties as assigned by the Assistant
Superintendent for C&I.
TERMS OF EMPLOYMENT 10 months
Salary as per SOMEA Agreement
POSITION TITLE Gifted & Talented Specialist
MINIMUM
QUALIFICATIONS
Certified as an Elementary Teacher.
Trained in gifted and talented (“G&T”) strategies.
A working familiarity with the Common Core Standards,
the NJCCCS and the Standards for G&T.
Knowledge of current research and theory in G&T
education.
A minimum of five years teaching experience at the
elementary level.
Demonstrate the necessary skill as a master teacher in
the field of G&T education.
A proven ability to work with and provide leadership for
colleagues.
Staff development experience desired.
REPORTS TO
Assistant Superintendent for Curriculum & Instruction
JOB GOAL(S)
To conduct training of teachers and administrators in
the field of G&T education.
To insure the quality and consistency of a
comprehensive G&T program district wide.
To coordinate instruction for students or groups of
students identified as G&T.
Provide modeling for the new program for classroom
teachers in the differentiation of instruction for G&T
students.
PRIMARY RESPONSIBILITIES
1. Works with students, teachers, parents, and administrators to strengthen student
achievement in G&T education in the areas of: academics, the arts and leadership.
2. Assists with the implementation and review/revision, as appropriate, of the District’s
G&T strategies.
3. Assists teachers in effectively choosing strategies and materials.
4. Uses district established criteria and collects data to help teachers:
Assess student needs
Differentiate instruction
Planning lessons
Evaluate student progress
5. Provides planning and support to teachers in the use of appropriate strategies.
6. Provides mentoring and support for novice teachers regarding differentiation for G&T students.
7. Models lessons and team teaches with teachers using effective strategies for best
reading practices in the classroom.
8. Works collaboratively with supervisors and principals in providing staff development at
building and grade level meetings in the field of G&T education.
9. Works collaboratively with teachers, principals and supervisors to create personalized
learning plans for G&T students.
10. Works with the Assistant Superintendent for C&I to coordinate G&T activities across the
district.
11. Job may require a commitment to provide up to twenty (20) days of summer
employment as determined by the administration.
12. Strives to maintain and improve professional competence.
13. Performs other G&T program support duties as assigned by the Assistant
Superintendent for C&I.
TERMS OF EMPLOYMENT 10 months
Salary as per SOMEA Agreement
I'm sure this convo must have picked up in a new thread after the April board mtg but I can't seem to find it. Can anyone direct me?
SuzL said:
I'm sure this convo must have picked up in a new thread after the April board mtg but I can't seem to find it. Can anyone direct me?
I don't think it has...we are all waiting to see what happens now that the people who wrote the plan have left or are leaving the District.
Do the BOE committee that guided them or the new head of Curriculum take ownership of the plan, or do they go back for further thought? Do they fill the position that was posted, or wait a bit?
Apr 26, 2015 at 10:40pm Edited
And now, not only has the BOE eliminated elementary school foreign language instruction (see online petition), and not only are they rejiggering and probably decreasing the already paltry amount of time dedicated to foreign language instruction in the middle school, now they're trying to get rid of accelerated English?
According to the Village Green:
The South Orange-Maplewood Board of Education has a very busy agenda scheduled for its meeting on Monday night (at 7:30 p.m. at the Administration Building at 525 Academy Street, Maplewood).
In addition to discussing the administration’s recommendation that the district discontinue the International Baccalaureate Program in middle school, ... and discuss potentially ending the accelerated English Language Arts program.
Significant changes to the middle school schedule — including reducing the amount of Spanish instruction 6th and 7th graders receive from two semesters to one each year — will also be discussed.
http://villagegreennj.com/schools-kids/boe-vote-budget-homeschool-athletic-policy-discuss-end-ib/
I hate the phrase "gifted and talented." I think but for circumstances mostly beyond a child's control that they are all gifted and talented. There needs to be a less elitist way of saying this.
cleg said:
I hate the phrase "gifted and talented." I think but for circumstances mostly beyond a child's control that they are all gifted and talented. There needs to be a less elitist way of saying this.
How is it elitist to recognize the obvious fact that there are kids in the world, and in our community, who are "gifted and talented"?
That means they're smarter, or more precocious, or more creative, or in some other way well ahead of your kids and mine.
Are we so small that we need to pretend these kids' right to a free and appropriate education is really only the right to a free slog through what they already understand?
JCSO said:
cleg said:
I hate the phrase "gifted and talented." I think but for circumstances mostly beyond a child's control that they are all gifted and talented. There needs to be a less elitist way of saying this.
How is it elitist to recognize the obvious fact that there are kids in the world, and in our community, who are "gifted and talented"?
That means they're smarter, or more precocious, or more creative, or in some other way well ahead of your kids and mine.
Are we so small that we need to pretend these kids' right to a free and appropriate education is really only the right to a free slog through what they already understand?
Are you forgetting this isn't Pingry?
ctrzaska said:
Apparently we live in Lake Wobegon.
Where all of the children are exactly one standard deviation above average.
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"Those students who possess or demonstrate high levels of ability, in one or more content areas, when compared to their chronological peers in the local district and who require modification of their educational program if they are to achieve in accordance with their capabilities."
to curriculum. Let alone the idea that the curriculum "hampers" gifted kids, or is "insufficient".
I'm also not convinced that the commonly used enrichment curricula really address the issue--even if they are easy to point at as a "program".