Bill Browder and the Magnitsky Act. Humanitarian Act or Big Scam?
nan said:
drummerboy said:You don't have to watch. But, please stop posting in this thread since you seem to be here just to interrupt, not to learn. I said ASAP because the last two links were taken down within days of my posting them. Otherwise there would not be an urgency.
but I donwanna
Who the he!! are you to tell someone to stop posting????????? What right do you have to govern who does, and does not, post??????
Dennis_Seelbach said:
nan said:Who the he!! are you to tell someone to stop posting????????? What right do you have to govern who does, and does not, post??????
drummerboy said:You don't have to watch. But, please stop posting in this thread since you seem to be here just to interrupt, not to learn. I said ASAP because the last two links were taken down within days of my posting them. Otherwise there would not be an urgency.
but I donwanna
I said please. Obviously, I have no control. I'm trying to have a conversation about Bill Browder and the Magitsky Act and it keeps getting interrupted by people talking about other topics. Maybe you can help me there and stay on topic. Can you please do that?
I have read through Browder's deposition under oath (376 pages) and I find nan full of s***. Here's one of the people she's defending. If all Putin's warriors can do is hang their case on Magnitsky wasn't really a lawyer (he was an accountant), then what would you call someone who showed up before corrupt Russian judges to represent your firm? Would he still deserve to die horribly in prison so these mob thieves could get away with their heist?
http://russian-untouchables.com/eng/olga-stepanova/
dave said:
I have read through Browder's deposition under oath (376 pages) and I find nan full of s***. Here's one of the people she's defending. If all Putin's warriors can do is hang their case on Magnitsky wasn't really a lawyer (he was an accountant), then what would you call someone who showed up before corrupt Russian judges to represent your firm? Would he still deserve to die horribly in prison so these mob thieves could get away with their heist?
http://russian-untouchables.com/eng/olga-stepanova/
You read a 376 page deposition and you won't watch a movie? Why are you so afraid of hearing the evidence presented from multiple sides? There is much more than just that the lawyer-accountant mix up. For starters, Browder said he hired Magnitsky as the best lawyer in Russia to help defend him when it turned out at that point he was an accountant who had worked for him for years. The accountant who was helping set up the shell companies.
At least watch the film before telling me I'm full of it.
dave said:
Are people in a movie under oath?
It's a freaking movie. You might even enjoy hating it. I listened to that fawning NPR interview.
nan said:
Dennis_Seelbach said:I said please. Obviously, I have no control. I'm trying to have a conversation about Bill Browder and the Magitsky Act and it keeps getting interrupted by people talking about other topics. Maybe you can help me there and stay on topic. Can you please do that?
nan said:Who the he!! are you to tell someone to stop posting????????? What right do you have to govern who does, and does not, post??????
drummerboy said:You don't have to watch. But, please stop posting in this thread since you seem to be here just to interrupt, not to learn. I said ASAP because the last two links were taken down within days of my posting them. Otherwise there would not be an urgency.
but I donwanna
And Drumpf said "please" when asking Russia to find the emails...What a distinction !
Yeah, I did not think you were capable of staying on topic, but thanks for playing.
nan said:
I said ASAP because the last two links were taken down within days of my posting them. Otherwise there would not be an urgency.
Because the filmmakers don't want it distributed for free (aka, stolen), I'm guessing.
even if Browder and Magnitsky were total crooks, there is no doubt Magnitsky died in prison. At best it was from criminal neglect. At worst it was torture and murder. So even if Browder is a crook and a con man, isn't he right about the appalling treatment his partner received?
and before anyone comes back with "what about" how the U.S. treats its prisoners around the world, that's appalling too. And Amnesty International and other organizations have tried to make our leaders accountable for that too. Just because they haven't been successful in holding our leaders responsible for abuses of prisoners doesn't mean Russia should get a free pass.
Okay, let's start at the beginning.
Nan/Paul, do either of you believe that Browder is a CIA operative?
Do you believe that he trained Alexei Navalny as a CIA & MI6 operative?
Do you believe that Magnitsky was hired to cook the books for Hermitage Capital, was arrested, and then under the instructions of Browder (also known as Agent Solomon) and the CIA, was refused medical treatment while in the Matroshka Tishina detention facility?
Do you believe that Magnitsky wasn't tortured at all, but became ill and was effectively sacrificed in a Russian prison so the truth about Browder and the CIA plot wasn't revealed?
(Sorry for the repeat, I haven't had a response to this yet)
Nan - can you just tell me which of these debunked lies is incorrect?
And since they're linked to sources - please link to your counter-source. And you're answer can't be - "You need to watch the movie".
dave said:
Are people in a movie under oath?
I have seen many Courtroom Dramas where characters are under oath. However they are just acting.
Only a Theologian can explain why such an oath is allowable or not really an oath or not really binding.
That would be an interesting discussion.
I do not understand why people keep arguing back and forth about Browder and Maginitsky. Don't you realize by now that you are not going to convince one another of your views?
nan said:
drummerboy said:You don't have to watch. But, please stop posting in this thread since you seem to be here just to interrupt, not to learn. I said ASAP because the last two links were taken down within days of my posting them. Otherwise there would not be an urgency.
but I donwanna
I call poopy on that! You completely ignored the below post which challenges your whole premise.
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drummerboy said:
nan said:drummerboy said: if you thought you addressed my question, you're wrong. Is there any case, in the current Russia-related issues, that you do not take Putin's side?Which issue? Give me an example. But, please, I'm trying to talk about Browder here and I'm very annoyed that this thread keeps getting hijacked, mostly with nonsense. I'm running out of patience and I'm a special ed teacher. I'm trying to find another link to the movie. So, far I found an interview with the director in Norway, talking about the frustrations of getting the movie screened. It has subtitles. http://subrealism.blogspot.com/2018/07/why-we-caint-see-magnitsky-act-behind.html
fine forget Putin.
The problem with this thread is that you are trying to make a connection between Browder's apparent unsavory past and the Magnitsky Act, when there is none, other than Browder. The Act is not invalid simply because Browder did some bad things in the years before.
You get that, right?
(Or maybe you have more explanation that I give you credit for, because my eyes kind of glaze over at your longer posts, so maybe I missed it.)
p.s. the fact that Browder was apparently misidentified once as a lawyer is not a big deal. I mean, Browder didn't claim he was a lawyer, did he? Why do you keep on bringing that up? It sounds sort of desperate.
Ok, so now there are 136 comments in this thread covering five pages and so far I'm the only one who has watched the film and commented. I have a demand that I respond to a 50 page document for inaccuracies, almost all of which are covered in the film. But, the poster won't watch the film--just insists that I respond to what he calls "debunked lies" He has no way of proving that these things are lies except this author-less document with a title that references a former Russian oil and gas company (with ties to Browder). He's just sure that he has the truth and I am lying but he won't' watch the movie. But, at least he's on topic. I appreciate that. In this thread that makes eligible for Poster of the Week.
I checked the link for the film that I posted yesterday and it is still working:
https://bit.tube/play?hash=QmchMdjdJ9SgH9oUH2UBd8xdmKWDpjdN2npYM9m8neMNus&channel=6255
I urge everyone to watch it while it is available. Someone mentioned the film company took it down, but it's important to note, if you watch the interviews I have posted with the director--he wants the film to be available. Browder goes crazy with legal action every time it is to be shown. So, in this case, you have to go a bit underground to see it. There is no other way. We are now like those countries that had to sneak in Beatles music.
nan said:
I have a demand that I respond to a 50 page document for inaccuracies, almost all of which are covered in the film. But, the poster won't watch the film--just insists that I respond to what he calls "debunked lies"
I only asked that you debunk 1 or 2 of the debunked lies on that PDF. If you can provide fact based sources to prove that the pdf is incorrect, that may help your argument to watch the film/
ml1 said:
even if Browder and Magnitsky were total crooks, there is no doubt Magnitsky died in prison. At best it was from criminal neglect. At worst it was torture and murder. So even if Browder is a crook and a con man, isn't he right about the appalling treatment his partner received?
and before anyone comes back with "what about" how the U.S. treats its prisoners around the world, that's appalling too. And Amnesty International and other organizations have tried to make our leaders accountable for that too. Just because they haven't been successful in holding our leaders responsible for abuses of prisoners doesn't mean Russia should get a free pass.
No one in this story claims that Russian jails are good. However, in the film, Maginsky's jail treatment is shown to be much better, despite the death. He was not subjected to direct winter exposure and he did see doctors during much of his time.
Another thing worth mentioning--from the link I posted yesterday--that according to the author, Browder could have gotten Magnistky out of jail at any time if he had just paid his back taxes. There is a link in the quote below to a deposition to a US Court by another prisoner who saw Magnitsky and said he looked fine and describes his conversation with him (which I will discuss in a separate post).
Browder values money far more than human life. During the year Mr. Magitsky was in pre-trial detention, he could have been released at any time had Browder only paid his back taxes, then about $40 million. Mr. Magnitsky told Oleg Lurie, a journalist who was in prison at the time under a fraudulent charge that was later dismissed, that he thought his employers would get him out, but they had betrayed him. Lurie gave a sworn deposition to U.S. Federal Court.
Mr. Browder wants to derail your attempts at a better relationship with Russia, because that could lead to the State Department acknowledging the truth about his tax evasion and illicit stock buys and cooperating with Russia, as it does with other countries, in bringing him to justice.
https://www.thekomisarscoop.com/2018/07/ive-been-browders-number-one-journalist-critic-for-two-decades-heres-what-president-trump-should-know-about-handling-him/
nan said:No one in this story claims that Russian jails are good. However, in the film, Maginsky's jail treatment is shown to be much better, despite the death. He was not subjected to direct winter exposure and he did see doctors during much of his time.
So the film's conclusion about his jail conditions are more accurate then reality? Or the denied requests for medical assistance. Please review this doc and let me know how the condition were "good".
ridski said:
Okay, let's start at the beginning.
Nan/Paul, do either of you believe that Browder is a CIA operative?
Do you believe that he trained Alexei Navalny as a CIA & MI6 operative?
Do you believe that Magnitsky was hired to cook the books for Hermitage Capital, was arrested, and then under the instructions of Browder (also known as Agent Solomon) and the CIA, was refused medical treatment while in the Matroshka Tishina detention facility?
Do you believe that Magnitsky wasn't tortured at all, but became ill and was effectively sacrificed in a Russian prison so the truth about Browder and the CIA plot wasn't revealed?
In the coverage of this story on Fault Lines Radio (who cover it frequently), and other sources (I have not read the well known book), there is speculation that Browder may have connections to the CIA or some other Deep State type organization. This is wondered because he seems to have effortless ability to speak with high level government officials ready to make big policy changes based on his testimony. Also, his former business partner, Edmund Safra, was a shadowy figure (moved large amounts of money on planes that would be impossible to do without the Federal Reserve being involved). But, there is no evidence to say he is a CIA operative or connected to the CIA or FBI, so the answer has to be, "Good question!"
I would recommend you watch the film to learn more.
nan said:
ridski said:In the coverage of this story on Fault Lines Radio (who cover it frequently), and other sources (I have not read the well known book), there is speculation that Browder may have connections to the CIA or some other Deep State type organization. This is wondered because he seems to have effortless ability to speak with high level government officials ready to make big policy changes based on his testimony. Also, his former business partner, Edmund Safra, was a shadowy figure (moved large amounts of money on planes that would be impossible to do without the Federal Reserve being involved). But, there is no evidence to say he is a CIA operative or connected to the CIA or FBI, so the answer has to be, "Good question!"
Okay, let's start at the beginning.
Nan/Paul, do either of you believe that Browder is a CIA operative?
Do you believe that he trained Alexei Navalny as a CIA & MI6 operative?
Do you believe that Magnitsky was hired to cook the books for Hermitage Capital, was arrested, and then under the instructions of Browder (also known as Agent Solomon) and the CIA, was refused medical treatment while in the Matroshka Tishina detention facility?
Do you believe that Magnitsky wasn't tortured at all, but became ill and was effectively sacrificed in a Russian prison so the truth about Browder and the CIA plot wasn't revealed?
I would recommend you watch the film to learn more.
What?!?! How much money are we talking about? For the Fed, anything less than a few billion is a rounding error.
However, I think Safra very well could be a CIA operative since the less evidence that this is so, the more likely it really is true.
drummerboy said:
nan said:I call poopy on that! You completely ignored the below post which challenges your whole premise.
drummerboy said:You don't have to watch. But, please stop posting in this thread since you seem to be here just to interrupt, not to learn. I said ASAP because the last two links were taken down within days of my posting them. Otherwise there would not be an urgency.
but I donwanna
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drummerboy said:
nan said:fine forget Putin.drummerboy said: if you thought you addressed my question, you're wrong. Is there any case, in the current Russia-related issues, that you do not take Putin's side?Which issue? Give me an example. But, please, I'm trying to talk about Browder here and I'm very annoyed that this thread keeps getting hijacked, mostly with nonsense. I'm running out of patience and I'm a special ed teacher. I'm trying to find another link to the movie. So, far I found an interview with the director in Norway, talking about the frustrations of getting the movie screened. It has subtitles. http://subrealism.blogspot.com/2018/07/why-we-caint-see-magnitsky-act-behind.html
The problem with this thread is that you are trying to make a connection between Browder's apparent unsavory past and the Magnitsky Act, when there is none, other than Browder. The Act is not invalid simply because Browder did some bad things in the years before.
You get that, right?
(Or maybe you have more explanation that I give you credit for, because my eyes kind of glaze over at your longer posts, so maybe I missed it.)
p.s. the fact that Browder was apparently misidentified once as a lawyer is not a big deal. I mean, Browder didn't claim he was a lawyer, did he? Why do you keep on bringing that up? It sounds sort of desperate.
You are not making any sense. Go back to the beginning of this thread and start all over again. Browder made up the story and then the Magnisky act was based on his lies. Russia is not as portrayed by Browder in his many positive interviews and book. Both Browder and Magnitsky were involved in the fraudulent activity. The crimes ascribed to cops or the Russian government were done by Browder with Magnitsky's help. Magnistky was abandoned by Browder. LIsten to the video in my first post (20-30 minutes of that) and then watch the film. Interviews with the film director are also useful.
dave23 said:
Nobody told me that this thread had a prereq.
Not required but highly suggested that you watch the movie while it is available. This will greatly enhance your thread experience and make it more enjoyable. So watch soon, like right now if possible, cause the link could be gone tomorrow:
https://bit.tube/play?hash=QmchMdjdJ9SgH9oUH2UBd8xdmKWDpjdN2npYM9m8neMNus&channel=6255
jamie said:
nan said:So the film's conclusion about his jail conditions are more accurate then reality? Or the denied requests for medical assistance. Please review this doc and let me know how the condition were "good".
No one in this story claims that Russian jails are good. However, in the film, Maginsky's jail treatment is shown to be much better, despite the death. He was not subjected to direct winter exposure and he did see doctors during much of his time.
http://russian-untouchables.com/rus/docs/P01E.pdf
OK, I have some information on this from a source under oath. The deposition was mentioned in the article I posted from the investigative reporter. (https://www.thekomisarscoop.com/2018/07/ive-been-browders-number-one-journalist-critic-for-two-decades-heres-what-president-trump-should-know-about-handling-him/)
She describes this testimony as:
Mr. Magnitsky told Oleg Lurie, a journalist who was in prison at the time under a fraudulent charge that was later dismissed, that he thought his employers would get him out, but they had betrayed him. Lurie gave a sworn deposition to U.S. Federal Court.
This deposition (https://100r.org/media/2017/10/Oleg-Lurie-deposition.pdf) is from the Prevezon case. You can read the deposition or I have started to cut and paste it here taking out line numbers and objections and interruptions. The witness, describes meeting Magnitsky in prison and what the conditions were like and what he said and also how he was approached to change his story later. I have only done part of it, and it takes some time, but it will make it easier to read. I will finish it in another post. So this is Part 1:
Q. Have you ever met a person by the name of Sergei Magnitsky?
A. Yes.
Q. And when was the first time you met Mr. Magnitsky?
A. It was in August of 2009.
Q. And where were you when you met Magnitsky?
A. I was in Butyrka prison. Butyrka,
Q. Where in Butyrka prison did you meet Magnitsky?
A. Okay. I met him at the collection cell, so-called. This is the cell where prisoners are accumulated before being transported to court to meet with their attorneys and where they spent on average several hours.
Q. Before -- did you eventually speak to Magnitsky while you were in the collection area?
A. Yes, I have.
Q. Okay. Prior to speaking to Magnitsky on August 8 or August 9, what were you doing in the -- in the collection area?
A. In Butyrka prison I was held at so-called thieves hall. That's a block where the most dangerous and notorious thieves are being held. And by that time I already had lot of experience being held in Butyrka prison, so when I entered the collection cell, other inmates begin asking me questions, a lot of questions, of legal nature, of personal nature,about living in the prison, and so this was the thieves block despite the fact that I was held being accused of a white-collar crime.
Q. Why were you being held in the thieves block if you were accused of a white-collar
A. I was held at the thieves block because I was a journalist and I tried to fight various violations connected with various regulations, not very good conditions for the inmates, and that's why I was sent to that special block, because I wrote complaints and I tried to expose flaws and violations of various regulations.
Q. So when you -- when you met Magnitsky on or around August 9, who approached who first? Did you approach Magnitsky or did he approach you?
A. I did not know Magnitsky, but he knew me. That's why he approached me and asked to talk to me.
Q. All right. And can you describe Magnitsky's physical well-being when he came up to you and --
A. Magnitsky's physical well-being was absolutely normal. He looked well -- dressed, carefully dressed, cared after. His hair was combed. He looked just like a regular inmate. He did not stand out from other inmates at all.
Q. Did you know anything about Magnitsky before he approached you and asked to speak with you?
A. No. Absolutely nothing.
Q. Did you accept Magnitsky's invitation to have a conversation?
A. Of course. I accepted it and we spoke vis-a-vis.
Q. Tell us everything he said to you and you said to him that you can recall in that conversation.
A. Yes, of course. Although more than six years passed since that time, I will tell you that Magnitsky asked me for advice, what to do in his situation. He approached me with a request. He said that he already had people in the -- taking -- having higher-up positions both in Russia and abroad who want him to be silent or keep silence about their actions and they will take him out of the prison within days. His problem was as follows: His attorneys, upon the request of the higher-ups helping him, asked him to write a great number of complaints for various reasons, both minor and various large-scale, global problems. He did not understood -- he did not understand why he had to do that, but he followed their request. And Sergei Magnitsky was concerned -- and that was the reason why he approached me -- that his complaints will lead to problems for other inmates both in the cells where he was held and in other cells. He said that he didn't want troubles for other inmates because as a result of his complaints, searches in cells were conducted, the conditions for various inmates were changed. So my suggestion was to make those complaints somewhat absurd, for example, to measure cubic meters of air in cells and mention it in his complaints so no verification of complaints would follow. And I also told him that his attorneys and people who claim to be standing behind him are lying to him. I told him that he will not be released, they will not be able to assist in him going out, because that was 2009 and nobody was released at that time, and he did not believe me. But he insisted that people who stood behind him are very powerful, especially those outside of Russia. He would repeat that they will save him, that they would take him out of there, and he also said that his crime is not serious. I told him to look around, and there were many people who stole merchandise or items worth hundred dollars and they were held in custody, but he did not believe me. He claimed that people in the West will help him. He also asked me to assist him in avoiding conflicts with other inmates. He also got so carried away by this discussion with me that he told me that soon he would have been released on his own recognizance, just signing -- just -- signing a document, where he promises not to leave his residence, and after that he would flee the country. And he also mentioned where; he said to England. And after that I sincerely wished him good luck. And I don't remember who was taken from that collection cell first, me or him. And, once again, I would like to underscore that I do not remember and I do not know how Magnitsky ended up in the collection cell, whether he came from his meeting with an attorney, whether he was transferred from one cell into another, where he came from, an integration and -- questioning, rather. And the same thing that I don't remember is whether I was on my way from the meeting with my attorney or waiting for a meeting with my attorney.
Q. During the course of this conversation with Magnitsky on or around August 9, 2009, did he tell you where he was being held in Butyrka prison?
A. Yes, he did. He told me that he was held in the big special block. I know what this block is. It's a cellblock for white crime inmates with cells with plasma TV sets, refrigerators, kettles. And those are comfortable cells other inmates can only dream about. Majority of those cells had telephone communication installed illegal.
Q. Approximately how long was your conversation with Magnitsky on or around 10 August 9, 2009?
A. I cannot tell you exactly, but maybe 12 10 to 20 minutes.
Q. How was Magnitsky acting during that 14 course -- during the course of that conversation?. Let me rephrase my question. 18 How did you perceive Magnitsky was acting during the course of that conversation on 20 August 9, 2009?
A. He was in quite happy mood. He was anticipating freedom. And he was almost certain that within a day or two he would be released, three, five, maybe ten days, he will be out. And he left a very good impression on me by worrying that other inmates might have problems caused by his complaints. But overall he was in a good mood and he was smiling.
Q. Before you were transferred out of Butyrka prison on or around August 19, 2009, did you meet Magnitsky for a second time?
A. Yes, I did.
Q. And -- and approximately when did that 4 second meeting with Magnitsky occur?
A. I cannot give you an exact -- an exact date. But that was between August 15 and 7 August 18, 16th, maybe 18th, a few days prior my transfer. That was approximately eight to ten 9 days after our first meeting.
Q. Where did you meet Magnitsky for the 11 second time?
A. We met at one of the collection cells. One of the collection cells. There are quite a ew of those.
Q. At this second meeting who approach -- who approached who? Did Magnitsky approach you or did you approach Magnitsky?
A. I cannot tell you exactly. We saw each other, our eyes met, we shake hands and started talking.
Q. And -- and tell me everything that you said to him and he said to you during the course of your conversation. A. Magnitsky was a completely different person at that time. He was a tangle of nerves and he immediately started telling me what happened to him. I did not know where he obtained -- wherefrom he obtained the information, either from his attorneys or through illegal cell phone communication. But the information was as follows: He said that he was deceived, he was used and deceived. They -- and by "they" he obviously meant his western connections -- made him sign testimonies and then -- he refused to do so. And it turned out that nobody wanted to assist him in getting out in the first place so he said that he was deceived. I did not expect to see him in such condition. He was a well-mannered person and I did not expect him to use foul language that he did. He uttered obscenities and he said numerous times that he was deceived and that he would probably never get out. And I asked him, Sergei, what are those testimony -- this testimonies about? Is it related to your case in any way? And he said, No, it was not. I suggested that he spoke with an -- his investigator with regard to the testimony that he was demanded to sign, but he said that it doesn't -- it didn't make any sense because it was a completely different case. And he was in a terrible psychological condition and he said that his psychological condition affected his physical condition. I honestly took a pity of him, because I saw his condition and it was terrible. And the last thing he told me during that conversation was that his western employers, so western people who stood behind him, deceived him. They demanded him to sign various documents that he didn't want to sign. And he also told me that he had a feeling that he would never get out of there. By "there" I mean prison. And the last phrase he told me, and I remember that phrase, he said, You were right during our previous meeting when you told me not to trust anyone. You were right that I would be 9 deceived and nobody will assist in letting me out.
Q. During the course of your description of this conversation you mentioned that he stated his western people who stood behind him deceived him. Did he specifically mention his -- his -- his his western people?
A. He did not mention their names. He called them patrons or employers. And he did not say west, he said outside of Russia, meaning west.
Q. What assistance, if any, did you offer Magnitsky during the course of this conversation?
A. The assistance I offered was medication, a prescription medication. He said, No, I don't need it, I have everything I need.
Q. To your perception was -- did -- did you observe anything that would have indicated that Magnitsky had been physically abused while at Butyrka prison during the course of your conversation with him?
A. No, nothing of the kind.
Q. After you were transferred out of 14 Butyrka prison on August 19, 2009, did you ever meet Magnitsky again? A. No.
Q. Did you ever learn what happened to Magnitsky?
A. Yes. I learned later from mass media reports and I saw his photograph and I realized that it was that Sergei I spoke with.
Q. And -- and what did you learn about him?
A. I learned that he died, he got sick and died. And I also read in other media that he was killed because he revealed fraud. So completely different opinions were published in media.
Q. During your time in prison did you ever see a prisoner being physically abused in any way by any prison personnel?
A. During the two years I spent in that prison I personally did not see any instance of physical abuse against a prisoner.
Q. Did you ever hear that a prisoner was physically abused?
A. During the time I was held in Butyrka prison there was only one time where -- when an inmate was hit by rubber pacifier or a stick. And it caused 3.5 thousand inmates go on a hunger strike. Information about that was published in the media and -- just because of that one instance, and the administration of the prison found it very difficult to end this crisis in prison. And I participated in that hunger strike as well.
Q. When -- when were you released from prison?
A. I was released on December 25, 2011.
Q. What -- did you -- did you return to work after you left prison?
A. Yes. I returned to journalism.
Q. In your return to journalistic work, what investigations, if any, did you do regarding Magnitsky?
A. We talking about investigations I did that -- connected with Magnitsky, that was with regard to inadequate quality of medical care in Russia's pretrial facilities. I also investigated Mr. Magnitsky's employer, Mr. William Browder, and his possible connections to fraud.
Q. And as a result of those investigations concerning William Browder, what did you discover?
A. I discovered that William Browder was directly linked with Hermitage Capital fund, which was founded by Edmond Safra, who died in strange circumstances after a loan from IMF in the amount of $4.7 billion was given to Russia and disappeared. It was on -- in around August 10 of 1998. 11 Also results of my investigations can be found in my articles, in various media, which is an open source.
Q. As a -- as a result of your investigations into Browder and Magnitsky, were you contacted by anyone to discuss your interactions with -- with Magnitsky in the mass media?
A. Yes. After 2014, when a film called Sherlock Holmes investigates Magnitsky's death was out, and this is the film where I investigated Magnitsky's connections to William Browder and -- and where I told about my conversations with Magnitsky, I was approached. And I also, after the film came to light, participated in Vesti FM program, which I've already mentioned. And also spoke about the film. I was approached by certain people who claimed to be connected with William Browder and who offered me money in exchange for substituting real facts with lie.
Q. Okay. So as part of your investigation concerning Magnitsky, what other interviews where Magnitsky was a participant were you able to find?
A. No, I was not aware of any interviews with Magnitsky with any journalists. I believe I was the last journalist Magnitsky spoke with.
Q. You earlier testified that you participated in a Vesti FM program on a -- on a regular basis. Did you ever speak about Magnitsky on the Vesti FM program?
A. Yes, of course.
Q. And -- and what show did you discuss Magnitsky on?
A. The show is called Full Contact or Polniy Kontakt in Russian.
Q. And -- and do you recall when you had this discussion on the radio concerning Magnitsky?
A. It was in the fall of 2014.
Q. Do you recall the specific date? 11 A. No. But this program is on the Internet and I'll be able to find -- find it.
Q. Okay. What did you discuss on that program?
A. I discussed -- discussed the fact that I met with Magnitsky twice and during those encounters I realized that the situation was different from what was portrayed by some media and western politicians. And I also promised to tell in greater detail about my conversations with Magnitsky.
Q. And how is what you experienced different from the portrayal in the western media? How is what you experienced different from the portrayal by some media and western politicians? How is what you experienced in your interactions with Sergei Magnitsky different from the portrayal by some media and western 12 politicians?
A. Judging by what I saw in Butyrka prison and knowing the system and observing Sergei and possessing certain general information, I came to the conclusion that nobody killed Sergei Magnitsky and that he also had to sign the documents and -- which he was made to sign, he didn't want to do it, but he had to sign them. And I also came to the conclusion that Magnitsky was not related to any investigation of his case.
Q. In the days following your radio broadcast on Vesti FM where you discussed Magnitsky, who contacted you, if anyone, regarding your statements on the air?
A. Yes, I was contacted. I received a call to my official cell phone number, which is known to many people, and the person introduced himself as Maxim and he said that he represented influential people in the west and he offered me to get in touch with his representative in Russia and to change my opinion and to solve the financial issue, meaning that he would wanted me to change his opinion with regard to Magnitsky, and the financial question will be resolved based on that.
Q. Okay. So to be clear, how did Maxim contact you?
A. He called my cell phone. He called my 21 cell phone. It was beginning of November of 2014.
Q. And when Maxim called, what, if anything, did you do to ensure that you would remember what you guys -- what you and Maxim discussed on the telephone call?
A. Due to the fact -- due to the fact that I from time to time receive threats due to my journalist activity, I record all calls from unknown numbers. And I recorded all calls with Maxim. Correction, with the person who introduced himself as Maxim, because I'm not sure that -- that was his real name.
Please don't post full transcripts on here - links are enough. I saw the movie also.
jamie said:
Please don't post full transcripts on here - links are enough. I saw the movie also.
I'm not posting the full transcripts--I'm editing sections and putting it in readable form. You wanted evidence and I'm giving you evidence. Should I not post the rest of my evidence?
What did you think of the film?
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You don't have to watch. But, please stop posting in this thread since you seem to be here just to interrupt, not to learn. I said ASAP because the last two links were taken down within days of my posting them. Otherwise there would not be an urgency.